Perak BN made a fatal mistake in the wake of the controversial takeover of the state government by failing to call a state assembly meeting for a vote of confidence in its nominee, Zambry Abdul Kadir, as menteri besar.

Umno veteran leader Tengku Razaleigh Hamzah told Malaysiakini that while Perak Sultan Azlan Shah has the constitutional power to name Zambry as the new MB, the final arbiter is still the state assembly.

tengku razaleigh ku li interview 190309 04 “Whoever claims he is the menteri besar, he is not MB until he is voted in by the majority in the assembly,” Razaleigh told Malaysiakini in a 60-minute interview last week.

“Of course, the sultan appoints him (Zambry), but the minute someone else is voted in by the majority of the (assembly) members, then he becomes the rightful leader of the assembly and the executive of the state under the constitution, and nobody can remove him unless the assembly removes him or he himself resigns.”

Because of that, Razaleigh maintained that ousted Pakatan Rakyat leader Mohd Nizar Jamaluddin is still the Perak MB.

According to Razaleigh, who is a prince and uncle of the Kelantan sultan, Nizar has not been officially removed by the state assembly.

Further complications

There has been further complications since the Feb 4 power grab with powerful Perak speaker V Sivakumar suspending Zambry and six of his cabinet members.

Even an assembly is called now - which under the state constitution must be held by April - there will be continual quibble over whether the seven BN assemblypersons are entitled to attend the crucial meeting.

The court is to make a decision soon on who is the rightful MB but even this will not resolve the political impasse until the assembly meets.

Razaleigh, who will be celebrating his 72nd birthday in two weeks, also told Malaysiakini he had no thought of quitting politics.

The following is the last of a four-part interview conducted at Razaleigh’s palatial home-cum-office in Ampang dubbed as the ‘White House’.

Malaysiakini: What’s your view on the decision by the Perak sultan to name Zambry as new MB?

Razaleigh: I’d like to fall back on the constitution. I think you can't go wrong with that, whether it's the sultan or not. Nizar, whom I feel is still the menteri besar, should get a vote of confidence in the state assembly, and he should do it today. And if he gets it, he is still the menteri besar.

Whoever else claims he is the menteri besar, he is not MB until he is voted in by the majority in the assembly. Of course, the sultan can appoint him, but the minute someone else is voted in by the majority of the (assembly) members, then he becomes the rightful leader of the assembly and the executive of the state under the constitution, and nobody can remove him unless the assembly removes him or he himself resigns.

That is why I maintain Nizar is still the menteri besar because he hasn't been removed (by the assembly).

Why not call an assembly meeting so that we don't have to squabble about who’s the real MB?

I don't know. (It would be better) to get the endorsement of the assembly (first), and then get the sultan to appoint the new man. That would be my approach. Not see the sultan, swear in somebody and start thinking about the assembly. I don't think that's the right procedure.

Do you agree with the sultan in not calling for fresh elections in Perak?

It is not a question of whether I agree or don't agree. It is his prerogative.

Yes, he does have the prerogative, but what’s your view?

My viewpoint is not important. What I'm saying is - the right thing that should have been done is to go to the assembly.

So you're not willing to state whether the sultan had made the right decision?

Well, he has his prerogative. He has rejected the dissolution (of the state assembly).

I don't think anyone is questioning his prerogative. They’re questioning whether this is the right decision, not whether the sultan has the right to make that decision. Given the situation where you have 28 seats versus 28, and three independents…

I still maintain that they should have gone to the assembly. If I were the leader of Barisan National, I would go back to the assembly, and not drag the sultan in.

Eventually they will have to hold the assembly by April.

Yes, by April, that will be the test. But why not test it earlier? Even today, as I've mentioned just now. If Nizar is confirmed as having the majority, then he continues as the menteri besar.

I don't want to talk about the sultan, because I think he was pressured. He was here… in Kuala Lumpur (during the takeover crisis). He had a heart problem. And he was rushed back.

Why do you say he was pressured?

Must have [laughs]. Otherwise, why would he have sworn in (the new menteri besar)? Do you see the logic?

How do you see your future?

My future? I'm here…

You have tried to contest for the Umno president twice recently, you didn't even manage to get nominated.

I couldn't have gotten the nomination because I don't follow the way people wanted me to. I don't use money - I never do anyway, although some people say I should get use to it and use money.

How to you feel about not getting the nominations?

Just too bad.

Don't you feel that Umno delegates are so enamoured with money they would not even give you…

You'll be surprised. There were votes, although I didn't campaign for it. Of course, those people who gave something have got better votes. There was support (in the contest for party president), I didn't go in blindly.When votes were taken, I missed by 20 votes, 15 votes, 30 votes, you know, out of a hundred over votes.

And given this, you’re still not giving up on your struggle?

No, that's not a struggle. I just want to see that the country is at peace. There are so many opportunities in this country for everybody, why should anybody fight?

That's my point, we are a country of young people, very productive people, we are rich, except that we’ve squandered our wealth through corrupt means, through leakages, through wasteful expenditure.

When I was the minister, we save that money - our development expenditure was spent with money from our revenue, and I reduced the deficit until there was no more deficit and I controlled the purse very tightly. No minister can spend without getting the approval from the Ministry of Finance, but now, they can even have their own tender.

They are able to buy things, but not under my time, I don't allow that. Everything must be bought through the tender system and proper products are evaluated and proper money spent.

Now you see the Auditor-General's Report, all kind of things happening, there is no proper care, they don't care about the money, they think it's easy to get money. Now we're having difficulties, there's no money.

Any thought of retiring?

I'll retire if I grow old, some people say why I remain okay because I'm active, mentally active…

So we will continue to see you fighting…

I'm not fighting, I'm offering myself… I'll continue to offer myself if people think that I'm still useful. I'll retire when I'm no longer able to move around or think properly.

tengku razaleigh ku li interview 190309 08 I think nobody should retire... You see all those people in Damansara, those who go to the masjid, they were all former KSN (chief state secretaries), they are all with walking sticks, and they are much younger than me…

They are only 60 years old and with walking sticks. I said, ‘What's wrong with you?’ I can still go dancing…

So Mahathir is doing the right thing? He’s still very active.

Yeah, but he make other people have stomach aches [laughs].

Full interview

Part 1 - Umno is already split

Part 2 - Possible for king not to name Najib as PM

Part 3 - What RM60 bil?

Part 4 - Najib's fatal mistake - failure to call assembly meet