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Did the police cover all angles?

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your say ‘Incredibly, the police did not appear to probe the possibility that the accusation against Anwar Ibrahim might be fabricated. This is a further insult to the intelligence of Malaysians.'

On He seeks trial in people's court, says Abdul Latiff

Lim Leong: Abdul Latiff Ahmad, please stop further insulting the intelligence of the Malaysian people. You assert that:

1. People have to understand that this is a game played by Anwar Ibrahim and that it is a ploy to use popular opinion to judge him instead of the existing courts of law;

2. There was not a proper medical report.

In response to (1) and (2) above, the fact is that there are two contradicting reports - an initial report which shows the alleged victim had no visible sign of injury, and a second report by a government hospital which possibly shows signs of sodomy.

I say possibly because no one has seen the second report yet. The fact that the first doctor is not a bowel surgeon is besides the point. Abdul Latiff Ahmad is simply trying to confuse the people and divert attention to the real issue.

The real issue here is that in a civil society which upholds the rule of law, the police will investigate from all angles. The police must investigate allegations made from both sides to corroborate with credible forensic evidence before a person can be charged in court.

I say credible evidence, because we have all seen that so-called evidence may have been fabricated and the judges are corrupted at the very top.

Incredibly, the police did not appear to probe the possibility that the accusation might be fabricated. Instead, all the government (health and police) machinery are put into high gear to have a one-sided probe that ended with Anwar being arrested with a convoy of commandos.

What was the charge against Anwar? Where is the rule of law? Where is justice? This is a further insult to the intelligence of the Malaysian people when the government insists that the police are running a professional and fair investigation.

In a fair and just criminal justice system, you have to prove ‘beyond reasonable doubt' before you can convict someone.

In this case, I would argue that there is more than reasonable doubt that the evidence is fabricated and that police are serving the interests of their political masters rather than the interests of the people.

Kiv T: I cannot understand how Abdul Latiff can become a deputy health minister. I just realised that he is also a doctor, and I wonder if his degree is real.

His statement ‘an actual medical report would contain more information and is properly written. What we have now looks more like the doctor's scribbling' was either made without thought or he has never seen a doctor in his life!

All doctors will scribble, and doctors' handwriting is always difficult for normal people to read. When the patient requires a formal report, the doctor will then translate their scribbles into a proper report.

So what is this deputy health minister talking about? It's really sad to see all these ministers and deputy ministers making fools out of themselves.

The hospital is now saying that the checkup was for anus pain, and not sodomy. Lucky for the public that the hospital GM and the doctor do not know how to lie very well.

I believe someone powerful is making the hospital make such a statement. Do these people think that Malaysians do not have minds of their own?

We are not like the BN ministers. We Malaysians will speak out and will not accept nonsense. I am sure our PM is enjoying this episode where his rivals are ‘killing' each other, but he also forgotten that its killing our economy.

Let's put all this to an end and concentrate on building the economy please.

On Hospital: It wasn't sodomy-related

Independent: The following findings were obtained after extensive Internet research. When a patient comes with complaints of tenesmus or anal pain, it is routine for a doctor to perform an anal or rectal exam to ascertain the cause.

There are two forms of anal/rectal exams: a digital or a proctoscopy (inserting a short instrument into the anus).

A digital anal exam, even if it is done by a medical officer, would be able to tell if there is any evidence of bleeding, anal swelling or anal tear around the anal area, especially if the injury is new, although a proctoscopy exam by a specialist is more accurate.

Whether the complaint is tenesmus or sodomy, the exam is almost exactly the same, perhaps except for the need for collection of specimens in sodomy cases.

Both digital and proctoscopy exams have the potential to induce injury to the anus, which would account for the presence of an injury to the anus if he was to be examined by another doctor a few hours later.

Mengchai:

Mohamed Osman, according to his medical report recorded at 2.14pm, found ‘zero active bleeding', ‘zero ulcer or pus', and ‘zero tear and scar' in Saiful's anus.

Whether he was examined for sodomy or not, prior to admission to HKL he was examined by a qualified doctor stating that no sodomy had occurred.

This is already good evidence, so why waste time and money to investigate further?

Not unless they wished to continue with their original plan.

Philip Ho: I refer to the two comments A Sepet Guy and Dr Hlasim.

To 'A Sepet Guy' - I understand that you are more familiar with the SOP at ER. I would like to pose a question here: If the victim was a female alleging rape, what would have happened here?

If the findings were that there weren't any gross injuries like redness, swelling, bleeding, abrasions, bruises, etc, does that mean that the victim wasn't raped recently or wasn't raped at all?

This question is posed based on your ending thought on your first point: ‘But having said that, no gross injuries does not mean sodomy had not happened before.' How should the doctor conclude the medical report to aid in police investigations?

To 'Dr Hlasim' - I agree with you that doctor-patient confidentiality must be practiced, as it is part of the ethics and code of conduct. However, I do not agree that the leaked report was definitely orchestrated by Anwar.

True, there is a 50% chance of Anwar's involvement in procuring the report, but there is also another 50% chance that someone would like to have a clear conscience and therefore would have leaked the report to Anwar.

It could be the missing doctor, or it could be one of the medical staff who doesn't want to be involved in the lies and conspiracies against another innocent human being.

Guna:

Pusrawi's general manager Wan Mahmud Wan Yaakob's statement on the ‘not sodomy-related' examination is baffling.

That means if you go in for a stomach ache and constipation medical examination, you also get a free examination of your anus for sodomy?

With the examining doctor recording the free ancillary examination for posterity?

Thanks for the excellent service!

Perry Dompok: I have been to a hospital complaining of constipation. Doctors never looked at my anus or wanted to do thorough check-up.

They asked me about the symptoms and prescribed pills. That is very normal and standard.

Somebody (and we know this by now) is lying here - Saiful goes to a first hospital and complains that he has been assaulted and wants to do a police report, but the doctor finds nothing to corroborate Saiful's complaint and writes it down.

Saiful goes to a second hospital and doctors suddenly find indications that Mohd Saiful had engaged in anal sex.

If the first report had not come out, nobody would have ever found out about it. The prosecution planned to introduce only the HKL report, as this is according to the rules. We would not even know about the Pusrawi visit.

However, the fact that it has come into the open poses a problem for the conspirators. It will be really sad that, after the progress Malaysian society has made this year, judges again show no principles and no backbone, and doctors behave like them as well.

Let us hope there are Malaysian doctors in HKL who will not stand for this injustice, as they are accomplices.

On Anwar gives statement at religious dept

A True Malaysian: If the authorities want to go ahead with this sodomy charge against Anwar, then ideally, this case should be tried by the Privy Council, a renowned and independent institution that legal circles seek in litigation.

If this suggestion of mine is not accepted by virtue of ‘face-saving' or another reason, then the case should be tried by the Syariah Court, which I think is proper since both parties have claimed that they are more Muslim than the other with their willingness in swearing by the Quran.

I am skeptical about the whole episode in which the investigation is conducted. Let's just hope that those involved in this case still have a conscience with them. Truth will prevail, ultimately.

Fletcher:

Swearing in the name of God does not bring about the truth to the whole episode. Anybody who is cornered will do anything on earth to fain their innocence. As both the parties are Muslim, let them prove it in the Syariah Court as it's their personal life.

The non-Muslims don't think it's fair to bring this to the attention and burden of the whole nation. Why can't the politicians be civilised gentlemen now that the elections are over?

It's time to bring economic benefits to the people like all of the advanced nations.

Concerned Citizen:

The sodomy accusations and reports are political blackmail. Everyone knows that this whole thing is fabricated and Saiful was planted in Anwar's office to gain confidence and favour.

He may have engaged in consensual anal intercourse, and that is why the Pusrawi report does not show any forced entry.

Our whole legal system is so messed up and mired with corruption, so much so that a person of Anwar's stature and importance may not get a fair trial.

Malaysians should make their voices heard to ensure that the next election is used as a platform to dislodge the corrupt government that we have now.

Ariffin Salim: It has been reported that it took eight incidences before Saiful decided to report the matter to the police.

Either he is not very proactive, or he is just playing along (for some potential personal benefit). Surely there would be taped evidence if he is just playing along, so that leaves just one possibility.

In contrast, how proactive is Anwar in making a defence for himself pertaining to the imminent charge? Does anyone, including the police, expect him to sit around and wait for it?

Isn't it logical for anyone in Anwar's place to work on a defence for himself?

In any case, he has not seen the actual charge and has to take on the challenging task of defending himself against all possibilities. Would it be wrong for him to get all the help he can get in assembling all the relevant facts that are required for his defence?

A Concerned Malaysian:

No doubt all Malaysians have been following the recent events relating to Anwar Ibrahim being accused of sodomy.

I would like to make a particular observation in relation to Saiful's pledge to swear by the Quran to prove the veracity of his accusation, and his daring Anwar to do the same.

This is absolutely ludicrous. This is analogous to the practice of trial by ordeal in England in the Middle Ages.

In England in the Middle Ages, there was a practice of determining the innocence of an accused by ‘trial by ordeal' - a judicial practice by which the guilt or innocence of the accused is determined by subjecting them to a painful task.

An example is trial by fire. This test typically required that the accused walk a certain distance, usually nine feet, over red-hot ploughshares or holding a red-hot iron. Innocence was sometimes established by a complete lack of injury.

What is required is transparency and impartiality in analysis of the totality of evidence, which is obviously lacking on the part of the corrupt and partial police force.

The attempt by Saiful to swear over a holy book and dare Anwar to do the same is but a pitiful and pathetic attempt of deflecting attention. .

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