It was a brief half-hour with Jose Ramos-Horta, the dapper East Timorese resistance leader who has spent most of the past quarter-century in exile from his island home. The youthful 50-year-old has spent most of that time travelling the world ("I've been to 100 countries around the world," he explained to a rapt public forum in Kuala Lumpur Tuesday night), lobbying support and raising the issue of self-determination for East Timor.

He has also played a key role in exposing to the world the genocide of the East Timorese since the Indonesian invasion of 1975, revealing in the process the complicity of foreign powers such as the United States, Britain and Australia in the Suharto regime's plans.

The invasion took place amidst a protracted civil war that began when Portugal decolonised East Timor in 1974, when the leftist Fretilin declared independence for the territory; the Cold War and America's loss of Vietnam at the time encouraged the paranoia and adventurism of the anti-communist Suharto regime.

The Nobel peace prize laureate spoke to Kean Wong.

With the success of the East Timorese and the rebuilding process that now has to take place, what have you found to be the response from countries like Malaysia which at the time had expressed grave reservations about the referendum?

Jose Ramos-Horta : Prime minister Mahathir and the foreign minister expressed strong support for independence of East Timor. There's sincere and committed desire to help us rebuild the economy, to stabilise the situation further. The prime minister was very prompt and positive in responding to our appeal for professional training schemes covering a number of areas - agricultural cooperatives, banking, including the foreign service as well.

We are very reassured by Malaysia, as well as other countries of the ASEAN region, particularly Singapore, Thailand, the Philippines where we visited and met with all the leaders. As well as China and the Republic of Korea... all of them have assured there is strong diplomatic moral support as well as commitment to help us rebuild our economy.

How do you feel now as a Timorese, given the conditions and destruction that's been wrought since the referendum and the high personal costs you've endured?

First, I'm happy, thrilled. Because there's no substitute for freedom. No material destruction can substitute (sic) that sense of achievement, that triumph, that sense of achievement of freedom for the people of East Timor. Everyday I enjoy being in the country and seeing people happy, smiling in spite of the destruction around us, in spite of the difficulties.

For this reason, we are even more determined, more optimistic about the future. That no matter the difficulties of today, the enormous limitations we have in terms of human resources and funds, we will be able to rebuild the country, build the economy that will be even better than ever before.

Does East Timor feel itself part of the ASEAN community, or does it intend to become part of a different type of regional grouping? How important is it for a young nation like East Timor?

First, ASEAN is extremely important. It is one of the most effective organisations around the world. This tour of the region showed us the warmth, the hospitality, the commitment of the ASEAN countries towards East Timor. If we had any misgivings about our neighbours, those misgivings were completely dissipated because of the warmth with which we were received. But also, we just have to look at the map to see how important the ASEAN countries are strategically, economically, not (just) for the region but the rest of the world.

However, having said that, we're conscious we have to move step by step. We're not in a hurry to join ASEAN, because we not independent anyway, we don't have the resources to attend the hundreds of meetings at every level, different sectors of ASEAN. We have to learn the issues, and we have to ask the foreign ministers of Thailand, Philippines, Malaysia, Singapore to

guide us through the intricacies of the issues, the procedures, the process in ASEAN.

When the time comes, the political climate is right, when we ourselves are totally stabilised and secure, we would seek membership in ASEAN. "But such a decision would have to come from the people in East Timor, the elected bodies. Right now, the CNRT, my organisation cannot make such decisions on its own...

With the success of East Timor with the self-determination process, do you think it gives hope and speaks to the other struggles of the region? Especially in Indonesia where people talk of Aceh and Irian Jaya possibly being next?

If we can be any lesson at all, if we can give any humble advice at all to all sides in the region where there are conflicts, our humble advice is do not use force, do not resort to violence. Use reason, use dialogue, all sides must lay down their arms. Guns, violence, false arrogance by either side will never ever resolve disputes, conflicts, grievances that are of economic, social or political nature.

So I hope that if the lesson of East Timor can be learnt by anyone, the lesson is do not ever raise your arms, do not ever point a gun at someone. Dialogue, tolerance are the best ways to resolve disputes.

Related to that, you noted at the public forum last night (Tuesday 8 th ) the culpability of some members of the Indonesian armed forces, including Prabowo Subianto, that they should be brought to justice. Do you identify any other figures you feel are responsible for this tragedy that happened soon after the referendum?

General Wiranto, he is implicated. He can't deny it. He could have disarmed the militias and he didn't. He told us back in June, point blank, when I asked him a question he responded, 'I can disarm the militias within two days'. He didn't because he was directly implicated.

And all the other generals: I can mention Zacky Anwar, the army's chief of intelligence; Colonel Tono Suratman, the Kopassus commander in Dili; General Adam Damiri, commander in Bali. And many others.

I commend the courage, the integrity of the Indonesian national investigation into human rights abuses in East Timor - they must be supported by the world community. And if Indonesia wants to spare itself from an international war crimes tribunal, to spare itself of embarrassment, then the republic must have the courage, the strength to bring those responsible for the destruction of East Timor to trial in Indonesia. If this happens, then of course we don't have to have a war crimes tribunal.

Speaking now of the future, what do you think would be the basis of East Timor's economy? For example, do you think the new Timorese government should renegotiate things like the Timor Gap treaty that was signed between the Australian and Indonesian governments, to reclaim such wealth?

( The Timor Gap agreement between the Suharto and Keating governments covered the exploitation of Timor's natural gas and oil reserves .)

Well, eventually a few years from now we will renegotiate. But our position now is that we will respect the terms of the treaty, we have already agreed on the basic memorandum of understanding that essentially reflect the contents of the Timor Gap treaty. We have no interests in causing any anxiety, any fear in the mining companies with regard to the huge investments they've made in the area.

East Timor has enough oil and natural gas to be well-off in the future, but our priority is to focus on agriculture, to increase food production, to guarantee food security for everybody so that by 2001 we are less dependent on humanitarian assistance from abroad.

What sort of government is going to determine all these sorts of priorities, what the policies should be? Is this going to determined through some sort of electoral process?

Right now, the legal authority in East Timor is the United Nations Transition Authority. And the de facto political power in East Timor is the National Council of Timorese Resistance (CNRT). The two work hand-in-hand, the CNRT and the United Nations. Together with other members of our society, we brainstorm, we develop ideas and policies for the next two, three years, which will be the duration of the transition administration in East Timor.

A year from now there will be elections, at district level maybe; there will be elections for the constitutional assembly maybe in two years. There will be an elected government, but I hope the elected government will receive an East Timor that is already stabilised with the infrastructures, both economic as well as political and legal infrastructures. So that the elected government can govern East Timor smoothly.

What about the rebuilding of institutions such as the education system, the judiciary and the police?

Yes, the rebuilding of the institutions is an absolute top priority. We're going to continue our efforts with the secretary-general of the UN and his special representative on the ground, and a few months from now I hope the money pledged by donor countries to the World Bank in Tokyo will be delivered and well spent on the ground.

In the meantime, we're working hard with the private sector, with the UN, with the World Bank to launch appeals and also fund projects, short-term job creation projects to address the huge problem of unemployment.

After the past 24 years of such difficult and often bitter struggle, which is the harder part for you now - is it still to come?

The hardest was the past 24 years. Now, we are confident, we look to the future with optimism. I have no doubt at all that we will prevail again. The most difficult was the 24 years of war, of genocide, of torture, of rape. So the years to come will be far, far more rewarding, no matter the difficulties.

KEAN WONG is a correspondent for the BBC World Service and The Economist in Kuala Lumpur.